My pure blood line CRS colony.. <3 (warning, lots of pics!)

[ADA]

Hi!

I just wanted to post pics of my colony which has grown from only 4 CRS and 2 CBS, (high grade pure blood line, imported frm Japan).. they are breeding very well, and producing a lot of very nice quality babies. *note, I have not done any selecting yet (have not removed any of the lower quality shrimp)

I don't really know a whole lot about grading (SS - SSS - SS+ etc), quality (solidness of color) or types (crown, flower, color patterns etc).. so I'd really appreciate it if some of you that have a lot of knowledge would be kind enough to comment, and let me know what you think?

I paid a pretty penny for the original 6, and so far, the whole colony are first generation from the 6, because none of their offspring are old enough to reproduce yet (although, they must be getting close.. the biggest "baby" is almost adult size now, and the smallest is so small that it's barely visible.

If I had to guess how many I now have, total I would say around 80 or so. I'm lucky they are breeding so well.

First, here's a FTS of their home...

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6155/6206473037_24457bdf6e_b.jpg


And, here are the lovely inhabitants!

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6153/6207254272_bbfd5bd36c_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6097/6209474321_5a6ed98fba_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6177/6209473983_aaf38d34da_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6167/6207254930_cb7db65034_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6082/6209473655_cfda901a38_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6189/6209988466_e904501632_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6196/6209473057_77d74ffd5f_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6218/6209472755_ba0b207c38_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6205/6209472471_cb640b7761_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6094/6209472181_c070c63dd4_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6171/6209987026_4993c72e53_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6223/6209471609_ec03ddb220_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6178/6209471313_ffa2d69025_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6234/6209471049_17d108a860_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6064/6209985750_e5bbc7d87f_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6180/6209985472_32d5542cb9_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6222/6209470145_19d54edb53_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6237/6209984804_ff4a46b1ac_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6187/6209469539_c2ea1fab90_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6079/6209469255_bc4f8dc2c1_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6052/6209469009_1c026a8a19_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6161/6209983644_616748efb8_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6091/6209468359_dc93d41455_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6231/6209468047_2621bb216c_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6154/6207255846_258aeb15b3_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6138/6206740553_e770554dcf_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6165/6206737933_f99d855f1d_b.jpg

[blacksheep998]

The second to last picture is probably the lowest grade shrimp I can see, but that's still an S+ and all of them seem to have very solid white color to them. You've got some very nice shrimp there!

Your setup is beautiful too, even with nerite eggs everywhere. lol. What size tank is that? A 33 gallon long?

[ADA]

The second to last picture is probably the lowest grade shrimp I can see, but that's still an S+ and all of them seem to have very solid white color to them. You've got some very nice shrimp there!

Haha! Uggh you noticed the nerite eggs. (I guess, there are a lot in there huh..) When I got my nerites, I had no idea they would do this. It was a nice little "surprise".. :undecided


Your setup is beautiful too, even with nerite eggs everywhere. lol. What size tank is that? A 33 gallon long?

It's a 12 gallon Mr Aqua (I think its about 10"X 9"X36")

Thanks for the nice words.

As you read forward here, it will likely become apparent that I have a LOT to learn about the grading of these lovely little creatures.. please correct me if I'm wrong with any of this.

As for the colors, I really do love their coloring. It's quite incredible to me.. I'ver never seen anything close to this quality CRS/CBS in person before.
I tried to capture it in the pics, but there's a special quality that is very apparent when you're standing in front of the tank.

Before I had my current CRS/CBS colony, I had another batch of nice SS+ - SSS grades, which I thought were extremely good quality (and they were great quality by typical CRS/CBS grading standards that I'm aware of).

However, even the very best shrimps out of that batch look dull and lifeless next to the lowest grades I have now. It's hard to explain, but there's an extremely obvious difference to me.. the whites are much more pure (no yellow or creamy hint), and the reds and blacks look painted! You can see these little guys practically lit up, from across the room, like little gleaming pearls!

Another difference I have noticed is.. in my past experiences, as the grading patterns get lower, the solidness of the color/white usually goes down a bit too, and you start seeing more imperfections.. yet, with this pure blood line colony, even my lower grades, like that S+ you pointed out, have the same beautiful solid coloring as the highest grades.

Last but not least, so far, among all of the babies from my 6 pure blood line CRS/CBS adults, I have not seen even one shrimp lower than S grade. I would have expected an A grade or 2, some B grades, and then some S, S+ SS etc etc... right?
The babies I'm getting now, are approximately like this:

15% "flower heads or crowns or similar"
25% SSS/SSS+
35% SS/SS+
25% S/S+
0% A or lower.

Anyway.. sorry to ramble on.. I should really stop gushing! It's unbecoming to brag about one's own shrimplets. Haha!

:D

Good night! :embarasse

[Aquacube]

This is LED light? How does it perform with high light plant like HC? It not seem very bright to me...
By the way, your tank and your shrimps are really nice looking! They seem happy in there!

[Soothing Shrimp]

I'm intrigued about your pvc system. Tell me more about that. :)

[imke_j]

Thanks for showing us your nice shrimp and your tank :) Can you please explain: why you keep CR and CB in one tank, what you understand as 'Japanese pure line shrimp' and if you did the import from Japan yourself? Thanks a ton!

[gourmettea]

Hey nice pics there buddy. :)

[Fento]

Nice tank and shrimps!! It seems an interview lol could you specify about led light? how are they distributed?

[Kazuya]

Welcome ADA.
Nice shots.

Keep them coming.

[Kingkong]

These are some beautiful shrimps! Very nice to hear you started out with 6 and now have 80!
Yes please do share your setup and waterparameters!

Keep up the good work

[baibai]

Nice Tank and shrimp u have there.:)

[2Toned]

Absolutely stunning shrimp... worth every penny, I'd say. And I also like the set up. It's very attractive... well done!

[rocky68pl]

Wow! Very impressive! Both setup and shrimps. I like them very much! Congratulations good breeding!

[HYUN007]

Nice tank BUT the offspring is no longer PURE as you put CRS and CBS in the same tank.

[dxiong5]

Nice shrimp, but the CB with the brown/semi-opaque coloring catches my eye. Would you think high quality pure lines should have better coloration? Just curious as to why this one is different than your nicely colored other ones.


Nice tank BUT the offspring is no longer PURE as you put CRS and CBS in the same tank.

This is where the definition of "pure line" becomes cloudy. Some consider breeding with CB ok to continue the PRL line; only when bred with Goldens, or have Goldens as offspring, is it no longer considered pure. I originally thought that to be considered PRL, it had to only be kept with CR, but I read and was told that it is common practice to breed back with CB. Of course, still one's own interpretations.

[blacksheep998]

Being as crystal red shrimp are a mutation from the black color that seems silly. All CRS have CBS ancestry.

Pure red line just means that these are shrimp that don't carry genes from any other breeds or species, like golden shrimp or tiger shrimp. These breeds can leave genes in the population that are recessive and pop up in later generations. So long as the CBS in this group don't carry any of these recessive traits the CRS should still be considered PRL.

[HYUN007]

Being as crystal red shrimp are a mutation from the black color that seems silly. All CRS have CBS ancestry.

Pure red line just means that these are shrimp that don't carry genes from any other breeds or species, like golden shrimp or tiger shrimp. These breeds can leave genes in the population that are recessive and pop up in later generations. So long as the CBS in this group don't carry any of these recessive traits the CRS should still be considered PRL.

By mixing them, the offspring of CRS will produced CBS in the next generation. How pure is that??? How many of us are willing to buy PRL that will produce CBS in their next generation?

[jorge_]

to me that do not seem like pure lines!
I leave a picture of a CRS pure lines!

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/270132_157988597605246_100001823209512_326848_2870 783_n.jpg

my point of view!

[blacksheep998]

By mixing them, the offspring of CRS will produced CBS in the next generation. How pure is that??? How many of us are willing to buy PRL that will produce CBS in their next generation?

The black color gene is dominant. Crossing two CRS will never produce a CBS, no matter how many CBS were in their history.

[2Toned]

Totally agree...

I suspect Gold on the other hand, is co-dominant.

[eviltrain]

just wondering how much you got these high grades prl / pbl for. cause i have some crs ( non prl/pbl ) which looks the same in my tank.

never the less, your photos are breathtaking

[foxpuppet]

stunning shrimp and great scaped tank...one day i hope to have similar quality!

[HYUN007]

The black color gene is dominant. Crossing two CRS will never produce a CBS, no matter how many CBS were in their history.

By getting better white, you risk loosing red legs dear!

[2Toned]

By getting better white, you risk loosing red legs dear!

Not if you choose a CBS with black legs. The gene for leg colour is separate to the gene for red or black. Same with white legs.

[madlan]

Could I ask what plants you have in there?

[ADA]

This is going to be a longish reply! Sorry, have been away from this thread for a while!



This is LED light? How does it perform with high light plant like HC? It not seem very bright to me...
By the way, your tank and your shrimps are really nice looking! They seem happy in there!
Thanks so much for the comments! They are amazing, I really love this colony. The light is fantastic. I had to lift it up quite a bit, because there was way too much light for a low tech setup, and I'm scared to run Co2 with these expensive shrimp.. But when it's lower, on this tank (because it's so shallow) this light is more than enough for a very high tech high light setup. I bought two, thinking they'd be not bright enough, because of all the reviews I read (from ppl who had them over MUCH deeper tanks).. I ended up storing the extra one, because one is way more than enough, like I said.




I'm intrigued about your pvc system. Tell me more about that. :)

Well, I have an Eheim 2213 which doesn't have enough flow to keep the water moving.. the PVC was my way of splitting the flow, to try to spread it out. So far it works pretty good, but I'd still rather use a filter that has more power, and just have the flow at one end and the intake at the other..




Thanks for showing us your nice shrimp and your tank :) Can you please explain: why you keep CR and CB in one tank, what you understand as 'Japanese pure line shrimp' and if you did the import from Japan yourself? Thanks a ton!

Pure line to me, means they have never been mixed with goldens, to try to raise the grade. It's the worst idea ever, because you get "higher grade" shrimps, but they get a dirty yellow color where it should be solid white. Unfortunately, so many ppl do this. and it has "polluted" most shrimp you can find in the US. Aside from some of Nikki's shrimp, I have never seen anything in the US that I'd consider to be pure line. I'm assuming the practice of breeding them with goldens is the result of greedy breeders, trying to get higher grades to sell.. I would prefer an S or SS pure line, to a SSS+ that's been bred with Goldens.. any day. You can see straight away the beautiful white that the pure lines have, compared to the regular CRS that are more common.

Having said all of that, I have seen some absolutely beautiful shrimp that are not pure blood lines..




Hey nice pics there buddy. :)

Thanks!




Nice tank and shrimps!! It seems an interview lol could you specify about led light? how are they distributed?

It's a Marineland Doublebright LED fixture, and I got it from Amazon. I love it.




Welcome ADA.
Nice shots.
Keep them coming.

Thanks a lot! I think it's time to take some more pics soon! Haha




These are some beautiful shrimps! Very nice to hear you started out with 6 and now have 80!
Yes please do share your setup and water parameters!

Keep up the good work

Thank you!

I'll take some water parameters and post the results in the next few days when I post more pics.




Nice Tank and shrimp u have there.:)

Thanks!!




Absolutely stunning shrimp... worth every penny, I'd say. And I also like the set up. It's very attractive... well done!

Thank you very much.. glad you noticed the set up.. I spent a LOT of time with the layout/scape :)




Wow! Very impressive! Both setup and shrimps. I like them very much! Congratulations good breeding!

Thanks!




Nice tank BUT the offspring is no longer PURE as you put CRS and CBS in the same tank.

See my above reply. I consider them to be pure, because they're not mixed with Goldens. IMHO, pure CBS + pure CRS = pure bloodline.




Nice shrimp, but the CB with the brown/semi-opaque coloring catches my eye. Would you think high quality pure lines should have better coloration? Just curious as to why this one is different than your nicely colored other ones.



This is where the definition of "pure line" becomes cloudy. Some consider breeding with CB ok to continue the PRL line; only when bred with Goldens, or have Goldens as offspring, is it no longer considered pure. I originally thought that to be considered PRL, it had to only be kept with CR, but I read and was told that it is common practice to breed back with CB. Of course, still one's own interpretations.

I'm no expert.. but yes, I do see how the breeding of CBS and CRS can be seen as taking away from them being 'pure". But, if you breed CBS and CRS, you always get one or the other, right? Never something in-between? Sometimes I notice the black ons are a little bit less solid black and the reds sometimes less solid red, but I would say that's because they are unhappy with water conditions, because when the water is good they color back up really nicely.

Another interesting thing, is that I gave some of the babies from my tank to a fellow hobbyist, who has VERY good water, and they lost almost all their color, and the white went translucent as well! I have no idea why this would happen, since my water is no where near as good as his. Does this indicate poorer quality shrimp, or is it the higher quality shrimp that are very finicky and can discolor?




Being as crystal red shrimp are a mutation from the black color that seems silly. All CRS have CBS ancestry.

Pure red line just means that these are shrimp that don't carry genes from any other breeds or species, like golden shrimp or tiger shrimp. These breeds can leave genes in the population that are recessive and pop up in later generations. So long as the CBS in this group don't carry any of these recessive traits the CRS should still be considered PRL.

Thanks.. that's what I thought.




By mixing them, the offspring of CRS will produced CBS in the next generation. How pure is that??? How many of us are willing to buy PRL that will produce CBS in their next generation?

Depends.. personally, I LOVE CBS.. I love having both. I might prefer the CBS to CRS actually..




The black color gene is dominant. Crossing two CRS will never produce a CBS, no matter how many CBS were in their history.

Interesting... I'm still learning about all of this :)




Totally agree...

I suspect Gold on the other hand, is co-dominant.

Eww... goldens are so ugly to me. You can see it instantly if a CRS has golden genes.. even the "highest grades" are ugly to me, because they don't have that beautiful pure, solid white.. just my opinion. I don't intend to insult people who like the goldens, or cross bred CRS.




just wondering how much you got these high grades prl / pbl for. cause i have some crs ( non prl/pbl ) which looks the same in my tank.

never the less, your photos are breathtaking

Thank you!... Lot's and lots and lots of $$$.. hahah




stunning shrimp and great scaped tank...one day i hope to have similar quality!

Thank you! Easy! I think anyone can do it with patience and the right equipment.




By getting better white, you risk loosing red legs dear!

I like white legs! haha.




Not if you choose a CBS with black legs. The gene for leg colour is separate to the gene for red or black. Same with white legs.

Another very interesting thing that I had no idea about!




Could I ask what plants you have in there?

Sure! Here's my plant list:

Hemianthus Callitrichoides

Fissiden Fontanus

Süßwassertang

Rotala Indica

Marsilea Quadrifolia

Hydrocotyle Verticillata

Hydrocotyle Sibthorpioides

Mini Pellia

Cuphea Anagalloidea

Downoi

Echinodorus barthii (I think)

Several types of Crypts

There are others that I'm missing, I'm sure.. most of the plants I have there are pretty small.. and some, I have just one in the whole tank, so I have a pretty big variety of species.

[madlan]

Any chance of some close up shots of the scape? The resolution is not great so I can't zoom in (Some amazing detail thats lost in that photo, really great scape!)
What stone\wood did you use?
Any Co2?
Ferts?

[ADA]

Any chance of some close up shots of the scape? The resolution is not great so I can't zoom in (Some amazing detail thats lost in that photo, really great scape!)
What stone\wood did you use?
Any Co2?
Ferts?

Thanks! Yeah I'll get some pics of the scape when I take some photos.. I just used mostly random stones from my yard on the left, and on the right are Seiryu stones (these raise the TDS a lot, so I had to remove most of them).

The wood is Hawaiian Koa (very heavy and hard) that I have had for years.

I don't use Co2 or ferts in this tank, for fear of killing my shrimp.

[ch3fb0yrdee]

ADA, If you don't mind me asking, where did you get your PRL CRS from? I've been trying to find a US seller, but I haven't been successful.

[maxgl68]

Congratulations on the shrimp!
Am I wrong or have any TYLO in the tank?

[ADA]

Congratulations on the shrimp!
Am I wrong or have any TYLO in the tank?

Good spotting! I have two of them.. cutest little guys ever.

[shrimp addict]

Very nice shrimp and tank setup amazing

Jake

[AznRice247]

how many generations did it take to get PRL mosuras? what grade did you first start out with? I'm planning on doing a PRL, I'm not too into having a yellow tint from cross breeding with golden bee

[lillith112]

Beautiful shrimp pics and set up, you also answered a problem I have with strange egg like things on my rocks, I have zebra thorn nerite snails, only 2 and was told they would not breed in anything other than brackish water. I have tons of eggs like yours :undecided, not sure if they will hatch though as I have never seen any babies.
Julia.

[triscene]

how about mixing snow white with pure line, is it understood as destroying PRL? i saw that golden (having red gene) are not making good white.
using snow white could be good as white is white and not yellowish, am i correct?

[ADA]

how about mixing snow white with pure line, is it understood as destroying PRL? i saw that golden (having red gene) are not making good white.
using snow white could be good as white is white and not yellowish, am i correct?

I'm pretty sure mixing any kind of non CRS would result in non-pure line. When you start mixing species, you not only get an ugly yellowish white, but it can get patchy and not very solid and bright.

[ADA]

Beautiful shrimp pics and set up, you also answered a problem I have with strange egg like things on my rocks, I have zebra thorn nerite snails, only 2 and was told they would not breed in anything other than brackish water. I have tons of eggs like yours :undecided, not sure if they will hatch though as I have never seen any babies.
Julia.

Thanks!

Yeah, those Nerites cam be pesky!

[ADA]

how many generations did it take to get PRL mosuras? what grade did you first start out with? I'm planning on doing a PRL, I'm not too into having a yellow tint from cross breeding with golden bee

I started with SS - SS+. 2 generations later I had a lot of SSS

[ADA]

Congratulations on the shrimp!
Am I wrong or have any TYLO in the tank?


Good spotting! I have two of them.. cutest little guys ever.

I love them! Mine were the mini variety. One of them climbed out of the tank and I found him on the floor - too late :( The other was in there alone for a few months, but I got sad every time I saw him, so I gave him to my niece, where he's still alive and healthy.


Very nice shrimp and tank setup amazing

Jake

Thanks!