My first F1 TiBee

[frontosa11]

Mother Crs- father blue tiger. Unusual colors. Should I let them breed or should I try to breed them out with Crs?

[2Toned]

Now THEY are really cool shrimp!

How exciting... how many offspring? Are there any other colours?

[frontosa11]

These guy are very timid. There must be a couple of dozen they come out at night. I was thinking about throwing this guy in there. What do you think?

[Abhishek]

Wow many really nice :) feels the shape is more of a tiger

[gourmettea]

What are your H20 parameters? Where are you in the US?

[frontosa11]

Water temp 22c. ph Don't know never checked. But my shrimp like the water here. I am located in the s.f. bay area. How's the water in Seattle?

[minicooper]

Mother Crs- father blue tiger. Unusual colors. Should I let them breed or should I try to breed them out with Crs?

do you have any pic of these Tibee's parents? these tibee's body shape is quite strange to me. They look like a SW shrimps to me. And the second post that CBS is a nice one with that red single round maro.

[imke_j]

Mother Crs- father blue tiger. Unusual colors. Should I let them breed or should I try to breed them out with Crs?

Both shrimp shown are cripple and deformed. You should not breed them!

[2Toned]

Both shrimp shown are cripple and deformed. You should not breed them!

Imke, for my benefit, and that of other less experienced shrimp keepers, would you please explain to us the deformities you speak of.

The clarity of the first picture is not good, but it appears to have all its appendages. The second picture is much better - still, I don't see a deformity.

I would greatly appreciate your advice on what I should be looking for.

Tony

[Dincho]

They both have a 'hump' on their backs, thats not right!

[2Toned]

They both have a 'hump' on their backs, thats not right!

OK, I see that. But it could be "normal" and accentuated by the angle, a posture, the very pale colouring - any one of these.

I'd like to see a couple more shots of each animal before making a call on the hump.

Anything else that I missed? I'm keen to learn from the experienced breeders here to avoid accidently selecting for these traits.

[imke_j]

OK, I see that. But it could be "normal" and accentuated by the angle, a posture, the very pale colouring - any one of these.

I'd like to see a couple more shots of each animal before making a call on the hump.

Anything else that I missed? I'm keen to learn from the experienced breeders here to avoid accidently selecting for these traits.

Hi Tony, here is a quick sample to show you what I mean.

http://www.shrimpnow.com/mygallery/files/4/7/2/8/body_shape.jpg

[Abhishek]

Thanks a ton Imke, for this valueable post, it means the shrimp whose back is elevated is not good for further breeding ,so we have to look for flat back or like the 1st picture.
One more thing Imke, is this applicable to all shrimps or is it for tiger only?

[Dincho]

All shrimp!

[imke_j]

All shrimp!

Yes, you can apply this to all shrimp. Do more reading in this thread: http://www.shrimpnow.com/forums/showthread.php/6530-Genetic-Defects-in-Taiwan-Bee
we also have to deal with roll-up antennae, slim carapaxes and over-sized balloon heads... :(

[frontosa11]

That is a great observation imke. I am sure that was a bad angle when I took that shot. I will try to get better shots of these guys. I am aware of the big head syndrome. I have heard of some shrimp that have won competitions with these traits. Reminds me of those parrot fish. I guess you can take inbreeding to a certain point and then deformities start showing up. Of course any shrimp that shows any type of deformities should be culled.

[imke_j]

That is a great observation imke. I am sure that was a bad angle when I took that shot. I will try to get better shots of these guys. I am aware of the big head syndrome. I have heard of some shrimp that have won competitions with these traits. Reminds me of those parrot fish. I guess you can take inbreeding to a certain point and then deformities start showing up. Of course any shrimp that shows any type of deformities should be culled.
I am sorry, man - but a better photo will not make the shrimp better :( these a freak shrimp, don't bread them.

[minicooper]

Sorry to ask, are you sure these are Tibee from your CRS and Tiger? Any picture of the Crs and the blue tiger?
They doesn't really look like the tibee even if they were in deformites. Coz their eyes shape, eyes coloration , patterns on the body. especially the thick white head band and the second white band on the hump part. And the location of these shrimps eyes, the head shape.etc doesn't like belongs to C.Cantonese. Coz Both CRS and Tiger are belongs to C.C. even the hybrid Tibee. It should have the similar features. The group of the shrimps that you show are more likey belongs to Caridina serratirostris. (Ninja shrimp) to me. The Ninja Shrimp got its name from its ability to rapidly change colors and vanish in the water. See your top right picture .some of the shrimp were almost turn into transparent form.

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa50/minicooper_hk/Others/NinjaShrimp.jpg

Imke, C.Cantonese with hump back maybe can classific as deformities. But can't apply to all species. my 2cents only!

[imke_j]

The group of the shrimps that you show are more likey belongs to Caridina serratirostris. (Ninja shrimp) to me. The Ninja Shrimp got its name from its ability to rapidly change colors and vanish in the water. See your top right picture .some of the shrimp were almost turn into transparent form.
Agree with you, minicooper: I should have checked better yesterday, but was short in time - they shrimp in the first post do not look like caridina cantonensis, but more likely as Ninja shrimp as you have written.

Concerning the 'hunchback': It is true that some ensifera f.e. or other swarm and brackish water breeders show another body shape, BUT I guess all shrimp can show abnormalities to a healthy or common shape.

[zane]

Both shrimp shown are cripple and deformed. You should not breed them!
Agreed with imke_j.
These shrimp have a hunchback deformity, I would seperate all of these shrimp in your tank to avoid this mutation. But besides that they have a great color. I'd restart though unless you want your F3 to be extremely unhealthy

And also minicooper is right, I don't think you have tibees there. I believe what you have is a cantonese and bee hybrid as one of your P generation and tiger as the other. This gave your F1 hunchback but and the body cantonese while still having the bee color and so tiger pattern. I don't know exactly, but still, restarting at this point would be the best plan, before you get too far in.

Good luck and keep us posted