Do you face issue of BGA - Blue Green Algae

[cjloong]

Coming from planted tank background, I have been facing issues of BGA in my shrimp only tank. BGA is usually caused by too low NO3 which frequents shrimp tank.

Just want to find out how do you all tackle this issue or if it exist or not in your shrimp tanks?

[silane]

cjloong, welcome to the forum.

It never happen to my low maintaince shrimps tanks, but my old planted tanks. Poor water quality, lack of O2 is one of the cause.

How's your tank setup? And water parameter?

[kenkht]

I also recently has an outbreak of BGA in my planted tank. The reason? I was slack in changing water for the past couple of weeks due to heavy work schedule. I started to do better maintenance and the BGA is now under control and getting less.

[cjloong]

Thanks for your help. Really appreciate your help. Thanks also fruitpie for helping me with fixing my login problem. Now can start posting. ;-)

Actually, what prompted me to post is that I did a search on BGA on this forum but found that no one posted about this before. That's why I am curious. My own shrimp tank, usually have very low to none NO3 (actually usually 0 ppm unless I overfeed).

So, what's the secret? ;-) How do you get no BGA with usually 0 ppm or very low NO3? Water change?

Anyway, I don't have BGA now. It sometimes it comes and go. I usually increase water flow and it will be gone.

[NanoDave]

I don't think BGA is linked to low nitrates.. I used to have a neglected high nitrates planted tank overrun with BGA + hair algae. :)

[cjloong]

I don't dispute that neglected tank or high NO3 tank can have BGA. Just look at the drain, even fast flowing ones have BGA.

I also don't dispute that low NO3 could cause BGA, perhaps indirectly. Reference to AquaticPlantCentral, algae finder link on BGA. (sorry, I can't link).

My experience with BGA is more to the second paragraph. :)

What I meant to discuss is, how come shrimp tank with low NO3 have no BGA? Or is my question invalid, meaning shrimp tank does have BGA in certain conditions.

Fruitpie, kenkht and NanoDave,
You refer to your neglected planted tank. How about your shrimp tank? Do they have BGA? ;-)

I think I am missing something in my shrimp tank which sometimes cause BGA. I don't think it is neglect as NO3, nH4, NO2 are all 0. Something I have to learn or unlearn from planted tank.

[NanoDave]

My shrimp tank has no BGA at all except a small area where the outside of the L-joint is. And coincidentally, that area is just wet and has almost no water flow while the rest of the tank has pretty good circulation due to the size of my tank and the way my inlet and outlet is situated. So doesn't that show it has more to do with water flow than nitrates? :)

Also, is is possible to show us a photo of your shrimp tank so we can see where the BGA is growing at so maybe we can infer something from it?

Im not an expert and in fact far from being one, so what I speak is just from hypothesis based on my limited experience with BGA. Hopefully this gets sorted out and I get another excuse not to change water so often in my other tanks :p

(btw could you also summarise what the 2nd paragragh on APC's algae finder says, that has corresponded with your experience? I couldn't find the algae finder; perhaps it is only accessible for their members only?)

[zwergkrebs]

I change 50% of the water every week. Never had any problems with Cyanobacteria (no algue acutally).
There are shrimp species, that should eat these bacteria I think.

[cjloong]

Shrimp eating algae? Come to think of it, isn't spirulina and chollera types of blue green algae?

[cjloong]

My shrimp tank has no BGA at all except a small area where the outside of the L-joint is. And coincidentally, that area is just wet and has almost no water flow while the rest of the tank has pretty good circulation due to the size of my tank and the way my inlet and outlet is situated. So doesn't that show it has more to do with water flow than nitrates? :)

Agree... Water flow does play a part to cure minor outbreaks. I currently use this method in one tank.



Also, is is possible to show us a photo of your shrimp tank so we can see where the BGA is growing at so maybe we can infer something from it?

Oh dear, I have more than 1 tank. The planted tank with cherry is the one facing this problem previously. I am talking about outbreak, not minor ones that can be cured by water flow. Don't have a picture of the outbreak though.

(tryied to upload picture but file too big. Tried to link but cant... please hold on) will try again :)




Im not an expert and in fact far from being one, so what I speak is just from hypothesis based on my limited experience with BGA. Hopefully this gets sorted out and I get another excuse not to change water so often in my other tanks :p

(btw could you also summarise what the 2nd paragragh on APC's algae finder says, that has corresponded with your experience? I couldn't find the algae finder; perhaps it is only accessible for their members only?)
You are right. Sorry about that not realizing that you need to be a member.

Quote from APC

It has been postulated that the cause of a BGA breakout is lack of Nitrates in the aquarium.

But to get rid of the existing BGA, two different types of treatment are available:

- Erythromycin (antibiotic) treatment.
- 3 or 4 day *complete* blackout (tank covered, not just lights off).

Remember to make sure your Nitrate levels are above 0 mg/l (10-20 mg/l is best) or the BGA will just come back.
One experienced which is not documented here is like what we are doing, increasing water flow.

In the comments, some people change water but still come back. There are some people who have enough NO3 but still have. Some put the antibiotic but still come back. Some people also put a type of chemical to complete eradicate it. I guess algae is a complicated thing and there is no silver bullets.

My limited experience tells me that perhaps its like this:
1) No NO3 -> stunted plant growth -> algae having upperhand. (NPK - N is very important in plant growth).
2) There exist other nutrient in the tank. Since plant not taking it, algae thrives.

[cjloong]

I am thinking perhaps this is one difference between low maintenance shrimp only tank vs. high light planted tank. Wait, Let me figure out how to post picture here. I'll post the parameters as well but this tank is no longer in service (tank leak a month ago). I am rebuilding this tank.

[cjloong]

Hi picture is attached. That was a month or 2 ago. That's the last picture I took before I tear it down due to water leak causing electricity to trip in my whole house. :(

I've transferred the tank to 2 1/2 ft tank already.

Parameters is as follows:
Size: 18 gallon
Light: 36W PL X 2 + 2FLX2
pH:6.6 - 7.0
kH: 2 - 5
Flora: Taiwan moss, rotala macranda, rotala rountifolia, glosso, ... etc
Fauna:
Initially bleeding heart but all died.
Now cherry shrimp and boraras maculata.

History
-------
Setup for 1/2 year already.
Went through an initial period of algae. BBA and thread. Fixed that.
After some time, went through haze in Malaysia and a lot of fish died(this tank is outdoor). In fact only left shrimps and a couple of otto.
A month later, BGA occur. Along the moss is mostly infected.
Treated antibiotic and manual removal. Dose NO3 in the form of Nutrafin fertilizer. (I don't have KNO3 handy)
Able to treat it.
Put in fish again, boraras maculata X ~20 pcs.
End of Oct tank leak. Transferred to 2 1/2 ft tank.

There were some neglect before BGA but the neglect is actually feeding and not looking at it everyday. Weekly water change and some fertilizing is still in place. Plants grows slower as well due to this.

[cjloong]

This shrimp was in there and gave birth many times already. Now, the tank is full of it's babies. But this shrimp died a week or 2 ago. It was with me since April but it grew really red about end of May. I don't know why, anyone knows? Someone told me that if cherry becomes too red, becareful. :shocked:

[NanoDave]

Oh dear, I have more than 1 tank. The planted tank with cherry is the one facing this problem previously. I am talking about outbreak, not minor ones that can be cured by water flow.



Oh dear! you have more than 1 tank with BGA problems!! I'll throw them away if I were you! lol (seriously I threw mine away like I told fruitpie spinex and simcb at beach road... but it had a snail outbreak too :p ).

It is actually a good thing that you have several tanks cursed with BGA. In fact, it is better since we can compare their different outbreak locations for clues rather than analyse just one. (btw call me blind but I don't see any outbreak on your photo)

I'm stumped by the APC part about 20 mg/l of nitrates being effective control against BGA though. One thing for sure is my nitrates was a level way higher than that (around 80mg/l no kidding!!). So how did that not do anything to the BGA? Not saying you have the answer - just thinking out loud.

[nano]

This shrimp was in there and gave birth many times already. Now, the tank is full of it's babies. But this shrimp died a week or 2 ago. It was with me since April but it grew really red about end of May. I don't know why, anyone knows? Someone told me that if cherry becomes too red, becareful. :shocked:
this BGA sounds really serious. i'm really new at this and not sure if my tank has this too but i didnt make any water change past 2 months due to pregnant and babies shrimp in the tank. how can i id this BGA? anyone has pic of it? did some internet search but cant find any. thanks.

[simcb]

This shrimp was in there and gave birth many times already. Now, the tank is full of it's babies. But this shrimp died a week or 2 ago. It was with me since April but it grew really red about end of May. I don't know why, anyone knows? Someone told me that if cherry becomes too red, becareful. :shocked:

I notice the cherries are very red in my High nitrate(50ppm) 4ft tank. And close to colorless in my diamond(low nitrate tank-12.5ppm). I am only guessing.

[cjloong]

I notice the cherries are very red in my High nitrate(50ppm) 4ft tank. And close to colorless in my diamond(low nitrate tank-12.5ppm). I am only guessing.
I have almost 0 nitrate when I have the BGA previously. It was then fishless(except for 2 ottos). I have to dose fertilizer to get it to about 5 - 10 ppm. That's what I normally keep the cherries in and planted tanks.

Is it good or bad for cherries to get so red? I first notice it becoming so red is when it is pregnant for the first time. It stayed this red til now. The others are nowhere near this level of redness. The scary part is some dark areas as you can see in the picture. What confused me is that this shrimp, in this condition for 5 months and gave birth a few times already. It survived the haze period where all my fish died.

I've got a feeling that this shrimp is mutated. :shocked:

[cjloong]

Oh dear! you have more than 1 tank with BGA problems!! I'll throw them away if I were you! lol (seriously I threw mine away like I told fruitpie spinex and simcb at beach road... but it had a snail outbreak too :p ).

It is actually a good thing that you have several tanks cursed with BGA. In fact, it is better since we can compare their different outbreak locations for clues rather than analyse just one. (btw call me blind but I don't see any outbreak on your photo)

I'm stumped by the APC part about 20 mg/l of nitrates being effective control against BGA though. One thing for sure is my nitrates was a level way higher than that (around 80mg/l no kidding!!). So how did that not do anything to the BGA? Not saying you have the answer - just thinking out loud.
Hi NanoDave/Nano
Are you guys brothers? ;-) Heh heh heh.

The reason why you don't see outbreak on the photo is that I did not take a picture back then. Sorry, don't have any outbreak now either, so can't take a picture. The outbreak in this tank was on the top of the wood/moss.The moss was covered 40% if I recall correctly.

BTW. I did throw the tank away. BGA is minor compared to tank leak. It is now in a 2 1/2 tank, setup 3 - 4 weeks ago. The shrimp died in this new tank.

I am thinking, maybe what APC describes applies to general planted tank which is high maintenance. Kinda like this tank. Your 80mg/l tank, was it high maintenance planted tank or low maintenance?

Or perhaps it is a case of "Too much no good, too little also no good." Thinking aloud here... ;-)

I've got a question. Can CRS take a little NO3? I am worried as these are expensive/sensitive unlike cherries.

[silane]

Or perhaps it is a case of "Too much no good, too little also no good." Thinking aloud here... ;-)

I've got a question. Can CRS take a little NO3? I am worried as these are expensive/sensitive unlike cherries.

Too high of NO3 definately gives problem, I dosed a tank in aircon yard with high KNO3, it ended up with thick BGA. My shrimp tanks has almost zero NO3, it does not has BGA, I do not dose fert to the shrimp tanks. The plants are growing slowly, oh well, that's a shrimp tank, not a planted tank. :D

[cjloong]

Too high of NO3 definately gives problem, I dosed a tank in aircon yard with high KNO3, it ended up with thick BGA. My shrimp tanks has almost zero NO3, it does not has BGA, I do not dose fert to the shrimp tanks. The plants are growing slowly, oh well, that's a shrimp tank, not a planted tank. :D
What is the light level?

Heh heh... maybe planted tank not suitable for shrimp, especially CRS.

[simcb]

I have almost 0 nitrate when I have the BGA previously. It was then fishless(except for 2 ottos). I have to dose fertilizer to get it to about 5 - 10 ppm. That's what I normally keep the cherries in and planted tanks.

Is it good or bad for cherries to get so red? I first notice it becoming so red is when it is pregnant for the first time. It stayed this red til now. The others are nowhere near this level of redness. The scary part is some dark areas as you can see in the picture. What confused me is that this shrimp, in this condition for 5 months and gave birth a few times already. It survived the haze period where all my fish died.

I've got a feeling that this shrimp is mutated. :shocked:

I guess its just probably getting old. Old shrimps have more red than the younger ones.

5-10 ppm hmm... I am quite sure its the No3 causing the cherries to look red in my 4ft no Co2 tank. Most algae outbreak, comes with high light and lack of Co2 and lots of fertilizer. Dosing fert will only worsen your BGA outbreak.

[cjloong]

I guess its just probably getting old. Old shrimps have more red than the younger ones.

5-10 ppm hmm... I am quite sure its the No3 causing the cherries to look red in my 4ft no Co2 tank. Most algae outbreak, comes with high light and lack of Co2 and lots of fertilizer. Dosing fert will only worsen your BGA outbreak.
I am guessing it could be genes. Her offsprings are very red even during young but not full red like the one.

Yup, agree that high light and lack of CO2 will cause algae outbreak. I think also high light, high CO2 but lack of certain nutrients will also cause algae outbreak. At least that is what usually happen to me. :p

I have encountered at least 2 times, I have to dose fert to get rid of algae. LFS usually recommend me not to dose but I find it worse.

My light level both times is on the very high side, 5 wpg.