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Thread: Ideal Tank's substrate and setup for CRS

  1. #1
    gary35111
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    Default Ideal Tank's substrate and setup for CRS

    Hi guys,

    I have been following some of your other more interesting post here on CRS. One particular message talk about nitrate level and plant fertilization being harmful to CRS. The substrate I used for my planted tank is ADA aquasoil. Are they harmful to CRS? I used to use normal and much cheaper gravel but was sort of "enticed" by a friend who talk about some "live soil" that can "eat" fishes and shrimps wastes so that one need not change water even for years. Of course, I am smart enough to know that he is probably stupid or just a newbie to aquarium keeping and maintenance like me.

    Nevertheless, I still bought myself these "live soil" and was surprised how beautiful in a 'natural' way it give to my tank as compared to the normal type of colourful or dark gravel I used to use. I have set up my tank for a week already and just added my 5 CRS 2 days ago.

    A pity my first and most expensive CRS which I bought weeks ago couldn't wait for my tank to settle and plant to root. It died and almost eaten up by my red ramshorn snail in my makeshift small java moss tank (Threw the little guy or girl away before it lost all its CRShrimpy mini diginity to the snail. I could have six CRSs swimming). The cherry shrimps survived. I suppose it is the water condition which become too unhygenic for my first *sniff* CRS.

    May I know if medication or ADA soil is harmful to CRS? The "live soil" (now that I know why it is "alive", contain fertilizers and , if I am not wrong nitrate elements. Btw, my planted tank have echinodoras tentellus & angustifolia, hygrophila difformis, red tiger lotus and a standing bridging driftwood with taiwan moss attached to it. I am hoping that the echinodoras will form a carpet or lawn effect in my tank. For CO2, I use Nutrafin Hang-on type. The one that comes with monthly refill. Aeration and water cleanliness wise, I use sponge filter and seachem biofiltration solution.

    So you can see there is quite a handful of 'chemically-unnatural-natural' things and elements in my tank. Will all those solution and Nutrafins CO2 chemical gas and ADA soils kill my CRS? They are only there about 2.5 days. no casualty yet ...speak no evil..( Man, maybe I am crazy or got the virus. I pay quite a lot for these shrimps...)

    Gary

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    There is no so called best substrate.

    If you are comfortable with neutral substrate then you got to bring the PH down with Co2 or peat.

    If you are comfortable with ada then you got to worry about ammonia and NO3 and later part when the PH down effects of ADA soil wears out.

    But its best to keep CRS/Bees in a medium-low maintance tanks(moss and pellia only tank) where there is no need to add any liquid fertilizers or CO2. The shrimps would poop enough to make up for the lack of NO3 later. Any medication for the fish is best avoided. The only chemical i used for my shrimp tanks is anti cholrine and cholrmine from seachem.

    As for CO2, dont over pump it into the water it can easily kill any shrimps. I managed to keep the CO2 under control with a Solenoid and a 24hr timer.

    PS: You got to cycle your CRS tank for more than a week .
    In fact whatever substrate u used u got to cycle at least for 1 -2 mths and test the water to make sure the PH is right, ammonia free, low No3 and correct temp and etc before introducing any shrimps.
    Last edited by simcb; 6th Sep 2005 at 10:11 AM.
    Regards,
    Sim

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    I heard horror stories about different types of substrates, such as flourite or ada soil and others. You have keep an eye on nitrogen byproducts (ammonia, nitrate, nitrite) and pH. On the other hand, I've heard stories of tremendous success as well w/o any shrimp losses. So I guess it's really up to you. I personally use plain gravel and have had no losses from it. I just prefer not to take the risk.

  4. #4
    rclover
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    I have had no problems keeping shrimp in ada, florabase, eco complete, and normal gravel.

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    In any case, base fert should be avoided, just heard 2 cases recently. One is using base fert, cherry shrimps were killed. One is using fert insertion, CRS were killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fruitpie
    In any case, base fert should be avoided, just heard 2 cases recently. One is using base fert, cherry shrimps were killed. One is using fert insertion, CRS were killed.
    Few days ago just ichy hands,because the moss is growing too slowly.
    I added only 6-7 drops of liquid fert,the next day found 5 of my CRS were dead Then i had to remove all e other CRS to another tank.But i found root monster is ok.w/out any casualty i mean.

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    Quote Originally Posted by star88
    Few days ago just ichy hands,because the moss is growing too slowly.
    I added only 6-7 drops of liquid fert,the next day found 5 of my CRS were dead Then i had to remove all e other CRS to another tank.But i found root monster is ok.w/out any casualty i mean.
    Strange .. i was dosing liquid fert everyday and my shrimps are still okay. I got Cherry, Tiger and Bee (new bee). Mine is a 23 litre NANO tank. Dosing Lushgro Aqua 2ml everyday. 2ml i counted before it's like 20 drops. I also dose Seachem Excel and Seachem Flourish.

    Recently i was treating some white spot on my Boraras dosing 2ml daily of Oceanfree for whitespot. The shrimps can still take it !!

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    Quote Originally Posted by spinex
    Strange .. i was dosing liquid fert everyday and my shrimps are still okay. I got Cherry, Tiger and Bee (new bee). Mine is a 23 litre NANO tank. Dosing Lushgro Aqua 2ml everyday. 2ml i counted before it's like 20 drops. I also dose Seachem Excel and Seachem Flourish.

    Recently i was treating some white spot on my Boraras dosing 2ml daily of Oceanfree for whitespot. The shrimps can still take it !!
    I saw some borara maculatas at a only a dollar each.. are they shrimplets safe?

    I asked about that but he said "Actually.... they are safe" but he didn't sound too convincing esp with that 'actually'
    Last edited by silane; 8th Sep 2005 at 07:06 PM.

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    Hi,
    regarding the liquid fertilizer, take a look on the bottle at first. Here in Germany special water plant fertilizer costs a bomb (about 8/~11US$/+16SG$ for 250ml, normal fertilizer costs 2 for 1litre) but they are worth the price because they are free of phosphate and ammonia, nitrite or nitrate. In very dense planted tanks with mainly stem plants, lots of light, lots of CO2 and very few bioload you have to add nitrate and phosphate to the plants.

    But in a normal planted tank with a few Echinodorus, Cryptocorynes, some mosses and a few kinds of stem plants there is no need for extra nitrate. When you feed them with flake food etc. you add more than enough sources of nitrogen and phosphate and the beneficial bacteria in your filter will help you. So a normal fertilizer which you use for other, non-aquaria plants would cause a lot of problems because the plants won't take up these rather poisonous stuffs fast enough and they will harm the shrimps and other tank inhabitants. Try to avoid to add any extra nitrate, ammonia,nitrite or phosphate and use special fertilizer. It is pricy but worth the money. I never saw a single dead shrimp which died because of fertilizer in my tanks. A few drops won't kill your shrimps for sure if you use the right fertilizer.

    Gary, let your tank mature at first. Be patient and observe it carefully. Use an aged filter if you can to support the new one. It won't help to let the tank mature faster than without it but the risk will be smaller and the parameters more stable. Be very careful with this Nutrafin CO2 set. The CO2 is not the culprit but the pH-swing caused by it can be dangerous for your shrimps. Their rather primitive organism has big problems with fast changes of the water parameters because of the osmosis effect. So just be careful and try to get stable conditions for them. They can adapt well to a wide range of conditions but thy need time to do so and the conditions should be stable, so no pH-swing etc..

    Best regards

    Robert

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    Moderator silane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spinex
    Recently i was treating some white spot on my Boraras dosing 2ml daily of Oceanfree for whitespot. The shrimps can still take it !!
    Spinex, what is the exact name of the Oceanfree anti-whitespot? Is it still shrimp safe at the end?

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